12:03:19 I'm gonna start the recording now. so someone asked prior to a starting.
12:03:25 I will send out the slides and the recording to all the participants after the workshop, so everyone will have access to everything afterwards.
12:03:34 Alright. so thank you everyone for joining us today.
12:03:37 I'll be talking today about how you can make your work open access, and then it does always have to cost money.
12:03:43 This is a part of our open access week events. I always like to start with explaining who I am and what I do it, Miguel.
12:03:52 So my name is Jess Collang I am the coordinator for Scotland communications.
12:03:57 So i'm a librarian my job as I like to tell people is sort of to be the on campus publishing expert.
12:04:03 So my job is to understand trends and publishing to understand open access.
12:04:08 How things are changing to be able to you know understand publisher policies, etc.
12:04:13 So i'm supposed i'm essentially a campus resource person for any of you right?
12:04:17 Any questions about open access, Scottie publishing, etc.
12:04:23 So the goals of the Workshop are to understand the main open access requirements of Candace and Quebec's major funding agencies.
12:04:30 We're gonna look at the 2 primary ways you can make your work open access.
12:04:34 And then i'm also going to talk about the library support services to support open access.
12:04:39 Now I believe we had a couple of people joining today.
12:04:42 That may or may not be at least if that's the case that's fine.
12:04:44 I am going to talk specifically to mcgill resources. but in many cases you're gonna have the same resources available to you at your institution.
12:04:57 We always like definitions. So open access is making literature, digital online, free of charge and free of most copyright and licensing restrictions.
12:05:07 I'm gonna focus primarily on the first half of that definition today.
12:05:10 So making things free, digitally online, free of charge.
12:05:16 Although the the copyright and licensing restrictions We're gonna see come up a little bit when we talk about the Frq's policy.
12:05:24 So I imagine a lot of you He already. has you're here, because you wanna make your work open access, because, as many people know, making your work open can have greater visibility for your research.
12:05:36 It can reduce price barriers for accessing your research.
12:05:38 It satisfies funding agency requirements so there's a lot of good reasons to make your work open access Now, in Canada.
12:05:45 One of the major funding agencies is what we call the Try Agency.
12:05:48 So that is shirk and serp and cihr
12:05:53 So they have an open access policy. It states that peer reviewed journal publications.
12:05:58 So it doesn't apply to monographs or books for example, It really applies to articles must be freely accessible online within 12 months of publication, and I want to really underline that 12 months because that's going to
12:06:12 come back later. it can be different. Versions of your manuscript can be made open.
12:06:17 Either the accepted manuscript or the publisher version. I'm also going to return to what that means but just kind of park that in the back of your mind it applies to grants awarded after may first 2,000
12:06:28 and 15 often. what happens? I give these workshops and then someone says, Oh, I have an answer.
12:06:32 I haven't realized and cih are actually technically goes back to January.
12:06:38 2,008. So these policies have been enforced for several years.
12:06:41 Now. So, after a queue, the final can share to you back also has an open access policy.
12:06:48 It's very similar to the triangency similarly It applies to journal publications once again not to books.
12:06:57 Has a 12 month window again in which to make your work open.
12:07:00 The Frq. launched its policy a little bit later in 2019
12:07:05 The one major difference is that it applies to student grants.
12:07:08 So if you have an Frq. like student, award the ever queue, open access policy applies to you now going forward.
12:07:17 This won't apply as of this moment but if you submitted an an Frq. application.
12:07:21 Say this fall there will be a new policy coming into force.
12:07:27 This following summer, which requires immediate open access, so ever queue will get rid of the kind of one year window. and then they will apply.
12:07:38 An open license would be necessary. as well it's not a retroactive, so it's only going to apply to people who get grants who are awarded grants essentially in spring 2023 any questions to
12:07:49 This point is what I call the preamble. So just general questions about the Grant agencies, open access policies or anything like that
12:08:04 Alright, we shall continue, and at any point feel free pop questions in the chat, and i'll i'll come.
12:08:08 I have bucketed in some question moments all throughout the workshop.
12:08:13 So there are 2 primary ways to make your work open access.
12:08:17 You can publish in an open access journal this tends to be what people think about, or seem to think as the primary means to make your work open.
12:08:24 But there's another option which is that you could publish in what we call a closed or a subscription journal, and make a copy open via an open repository like Mcgill's scholarship
12:08:34 I'm going to dive more deeply into both of those options. So the first one, as you mentioned is publishing a quote gold or an open journal you might So those are journals whose entire contents are freely open So you know you
12:08:49 go to plus doesn't matter if you're at Mcgill if you have a subscription, everything and plus is open to anyone.
12:08:55 It's a fully open access journal there's lots of other examples.
12:08:59 I'm sure you can think of some from your disciplines i've just threw up a couple.
12:09:03 But these are all what we call fully open access journals.
12:09:07 So in this case, as I mentioned you go to the website, you go to Pdf and Boo.
12:09:13 You get access you can read it, you don't Have to pay a fee, or belong to a specific institution in order to read it.
12:09:22 If you're curious to find gold open access journals in your discipline, there is a directory of open access journals you can use.
12:09:27 I put the link to it there, as I mentioned i'll send the slides out afterwards, so you can search in this directory limit on you know your subject, etc.
12:09:38 I always tell people, you know you still have to say, use the same critical lens.
12:09:42 So always review any journal you're interested in submitting to for you know its editorial board.
12:09:47 It's scope. look at the different articles it publishes to make sure it needs certain levels of quality that you're interested in.
12:09:57 Now I go open access often, though has what's called an article processing charge.
12:10:01 So so, because you know the journal isn't getting subscription revenue, and there are some publishing costs what journals have done, or what this model has, is that that authors once they're accepted for publication pay
12:10:13 a fee. This V is called an Epc. or an article processing charge.
12:10:19 Just in case you're curious these fees very very very very widely.
12:10:22 So you look at plus, I think that's actually should not be I think it's up to 1,800.
12:10:26 Now, but you know, around 17 $1,800 Us
12:10:31 Bmc. you know, $3,600. Glossa, which is a linguistics journal, is obviously a lot cheaper.
12:10:38 And then I should say there are some open access journals that don't charge fees at all.
12:10:41 So I put the Canadian Journal of Regional Science in there.
12:10:45 The journals that are open access that don't charge fees.
12:10:48 These tend to happen more in the social sciences and humanities generally.
12:10:53 Then, then, in other disciplines. but but you may be able to find some in your discipline, but just a note that they do exist.
12:10:59 Now, if you look at this chart you might ask but why is plus, you know, 1,800 and Bmcs, you know, almost 4,000.
12:11:10 There's not really a good answer the general consensus is up there.
12:11:15 Journals charge what they are able to charge like like journals charge what they think they can get money for particularly commercial journals. If you're curious to read more about. you know apcs and and transparency i
12:11:26 put some, some links below to some studies but there's some evidence that no, it does not actually cost $4,000 necessarily to make your article open. There's a correlation, in some type cases that a journal that has a higher impact.
12:11:41 factor will have a higher Apc meaning. They just think authors are more willing to pay.
12:11:44 Okay, so. that's just a note but if you're curious to read more. I put a couple articles below.
12:11:51 That might be of interest. Now Miguel does have article processing charge discounts.
12:11:58 So Miguel is part of a national consortium called Crk. N.
12:12:01 So when we go to subscribe to journals we often are able to kind of get discounts on publishing open access with them.
12:12:08 So i've put a couple of those up here just as an examples, and I put a link on this slide also to the full list of my gills apc discounts.
12:12:18 So these are ones where we get a discount. you get like a 15% or 20% off.
12:12:23 We are more and more negotiating ones, where we completely are able to cover the cost of publishing open access.
12:12:29 So last january. we signed with sage an agreement that allowed authors publishing with their what'll call their choice journals.
12:12:36 So say just choice duringals are there they're close journals. you can make your work open at no cost with those journals.
12:12:45 There are like 7 or 8 exceptions but that's pretty new, and that people have really been interested in that have you also, as I mentioned, have a a discount of 40% with her fully open access journalists things that need
12:12:59 to really pay attention to, though. you have to be the corresponding author.
12:13:04 So in a lot of cases these discounts only apply to the corresponding author, and they're opt in systems.
12:13:10 So usually. What happens is when your article is accepted you'll get sent an email saying what you'd like to opt into has open access agreement.
12:13:18 I often find authors think it's spam or they delete it, or they don't realize we're trying to be more proactive in letting people know about these agreements.
12:13:26 But it is opt-in it won't happen automatically and we've negotiated a couple of other agreements like that.
12:13:34 So Cambridge just happened in you know jan this january the twentieth 2 similarly it's corresponding authors again.
12:13:41 It's also opt-in, but I believe it applies to almost all of Cambridge's journals.
12:13:45 Once again. There are a few exceptions, but similarly you know if you're the corresponding author, and you've published with a Cambridge journal.
12:13:53 You should get an email that asks would you like to make your work open. And so that's something that's been negotiated.
12:13:58 The other agreements we have that are like this is there's company of biologists is similar.
12:14:04 As well as cargo. so these are a couple of agreements we're we're adding more as we go along in negotiations, but i'd like to point these out because a lot of people aren't
12:14:13 aware of them
12:14:18 Alright any questions about what gold, open access, or any of the negotiated discounts or agreements we have
12:14:32 Alright, I will continue on to the next model of open access.
12:14:37 So that was what we called gold route you publish in an open access journal potentially.
12:14:42 You pay a fee and then the articles open alongside all the other articles in the journal.
12:14:49 Now the second model, which is almost overlooked but is considered as it's, just as legitimate as as the gold model is called green open access.
12:14:57 This is where you post a version to an open repository, and most people don't realize but lots of i'm just these are not random journals, but most journals allow you to do this Now, there's often
12:15:10 kind of caveats on on when you can do it, and and kind of how.
12:15:15 But most journals have what we call a self- archiving policy, or a policy that allows you to make a version open.
12:15:21 So here's an example. But this would look like So this is a journal article that was published in the Journal of Experimental Child.
12:15:27 So this is what it looks like, on the publisher's website, So so if you were to go there you would see, you know, purchase Pdf.
12:15:35 And then it would ask you to pay $40 or whatever in order to access this article.
12:15:42 This article has also been made open in the Middle East Scholarship.
12:15:44 So we came to magazine scholarship. You could download this article for free. The accepted manuscript version of the article is posted to East Scholarship.
12:15:54 So this would be A. This is kind of the green route.
12:15:57 So version of the article has been made open. People often wanna work.
12:16:03 But how would someone find this free version of my paper?
12:16:05 So, ego, you scholarship is pretty well indexed in what I call regular Google.
12:16:09 So say, someone had typed the title of your article into Google.
12:16:13 You can see in this case, at least in my Google world.
12:16:18 The are you scholarship article comes to the very top.
12:16:23 We're also in Google Scholar the the difference with Google Scholar.
12:16:26 That was Google scholar sort of collects all the different versions of the article that might be out there.
12:16:31 The top level link is the one that gets linked to the most so usually by default.
12:16:35 The top level link is the publisher website. But if you see if you click under all versions, you can see here.
12:16:44 The fourth result is the scholarship so that's How people could find the open copy.
12:16:48 We're also in there's an open access Browser Plugin called on paywall, so someone was using that browser plugin to discover free content.
12:16:57 It would come to the open. the scholarship link things like that.
12:17:01 What I often tell people to do is if you say have a website or a listing of your articles. you put your citation up and then link to the free version of the article that's what I do on my own websites, that people
12:17:13 come across, or, if you have assume who's interested in working with you. You know the free versions of your paper are posted alongside.
12:17:19 You know your citations on your website, or your departmental homepage, etc.
12:17:27 So this is a big question, but doesn't this file like copyright.
12:17:31 The answer to that is no but it's only permitted to do this for certain versions of your manuscript.
12:17:36 Sometimes there's a delay before you can make an open copy, so they'll let you post an open repository, but not for 12 months or 24 months. so you always wanna check your publishing agreement or check with someone like
12:17:48 me. Now keep mentioning the version of your article you're allowed to do certain things with certain versions of your article. so I want to talk about what those versions are.
12:17:59 When you first go to submit to a journal that article is called your preprint.
12:18:04 So you've you've written your article you've sent it off to a journal that's your pre print. it's kind of considered the first version of your manuscript.
12:18:13 Well, it's at the journal it's gonna go through Peer review.
12:18:15 You're gonna make some changes, you're probably gonna send it back, make more changes, etc.
12:18:21 Finally the article, is going to be accepted that's called the accepted manuscript. So the article has been accepted for publication, but it hasn't gone through type setting layout copy editing that's called the
12:18:34 publisher version, you will have the most rights for the first 2, for the pre-print and the accepted manuscript.
12:18:41 Typically you're not allowed to do almost anything with the final publisher. Pdf.
12:18:46 For the grand stuff we talked about at the beginning. So the Try Agency in the effort queue. you have to make open either the accepted manuscript version or the final publisher.
12:18:55 Pdf: So many publishers are gonna let you post to a repository.
12:19:01 The accepted manuscript version. So just the I really want.
12:19:05 I really want to hammer this home because I feel like this is one of the most important things I can tell you.
12:19:09 A lot of authors aren't real don't realize they can do this.
12:19:13 You need to save the accepted manuscript version of the paper yourself. Now, sometimes you can find this in the submission systems.
12:19:21 Sometimes it's not perfect. I always tell people to act on acceptance. So when you're article is accepted, that is the moment to find you know, to take that version of your manuscript label.
12:19:31 It accepted manuscript or whatever so that you know that that's the version.
12:19:36 If if your file formatting looks anything like mine, you often end up final revision.
12:19:42 Revise second time 2 etc. label your accepted manuscript, because this is the version that can typically be posted to repositories, and it's more or less the same content as the final
12:19:53 publisher version. It just hasn't gone through that sort of a layout type setting process, and the accepted manuscript can meet open access requirements.
12:20:06 I'll be a lot of questions about the accepted manuscript they ask, you know, is this the proof of your article?
12:20:12 Typically No, because the proof has been typeset usually so it's going to be the version prior to the proof.
12:20:16 So stage is it a word, Doc? sometimes. Yeah, they can definitely be a word, doc.
12:20:23 It depends on how the publisher wanted you to submit your revised manuscript.
12:20:29 But yeah, usually, and you'll sometimes have to lease with your co-authors right?
12:20:32 So we have several co-authors. you're gonna have to lease with them, because maybe they're the ones submitting the revised manuscript to the system?
12:20:40 And can you find it in the publisher system once again?
12:20:42 Sometimes there is an online guide for how to go into the different publisher submission systems, and sometimes you can go like poke around and find this version of your of your manuscript
12:20:57 So that's green open access or self archiving in a nutshell?
12:21:00 Are there questions about this method? See something in the chat? right?
12:21:06 So someone asks if our E scholarships versions are automatically synced with Google scholar or to sometimes it need to be done manually.
12:21:13 So you, you scholarship is is crawled by Google Scholar automatically.
12:21:19 What sometimes happens. there is sometimes a lay, because Google scholar only runs its crawlers.
12:21:24 I think they said when I wrote them about this like every 6 months.
12:21:28 So sometimes there is a delay between when it goes into e scholarship, and when it's shows up in Google scholar.
12:21:34 But you shouldn't have to do sort of anything like on your end like it should.
12:21:39 Just it should just show up a Google scholar. And someone asked, Can we share the accepted manuscript versions on research?
12:21:47 Gator academia edu websites. This is really good question.
12:21:53 Unfortunately, a lot of publishers have clauses in their agreements, but that explicitly exclude what we call commercial use.
12:21:59 So they say, for your accepted manuscript you're allowed to post it to an open repository. so long as it's not commercial, and because research gate and academic edu are commercial entities technically
12:22:13 that that isn't usually allowed now your preprint that very initial submission could be posted.
12:22:18 But they accepted manuscript there's often there's often an exclusion for commercial use.
12:22:27 These are good questions. Are there any other questions about so archiving or accepted manuscripts
12:22:37 Alright keep going. so I wanted to talk a little bit about Mcgill's repository. you scholarship, as I mentioned. anyone is joining us. It's not from Mcgill likely your institution has a
12:22:48 repository, and has similar services as well. So ask your librarian,
12:22:53 So magazine scholarship is open and accessible to anyone anywhere in the world.
12:22:58 People sometimes seem to think that it's like locked only to Mcgill users, but that's not the case.
12:23:02 So if you graduate from Miguel for students, for example, your theses and dissertations will also end up in Mcgill.
12:23:09 Anyone can search it download Good stuff it's not like locked to Mcgill users only oops.
12:23:17 I just accidentally clicked that. okay Anyone affiliated with Miguel Ken deposit.
12:23:23 That's the only requirement so mcgill student staff faculty, etc. and deposit with you scholarship, as I mentioned it meets try agency and frq requirements so long as I guess you're
12:23:35 able to deposit in the right time frame right so if you're. if the journal says you can't deposit for 24 months, that's longer than the 12 month window permitted.
12:23:44 But you can pro if you can deposit within 6 months or 12 months putting it in the scholarship is going to meet those criteria I've mentioned before.
12:23:53 It's in Google and Google scholar in terms of deposit.
12:23:56 We have an online deposit form. so you fill it out.
12:23:59 You can upload multiple files. If you have several accepted manuscripts, we always check the copyright permissions.
12:24:06 We do that work for you. so if you send us something and we can't upload it.
12:24:09 We'll let you know like we'll check and then we'll write you and say, Oh, actually this is the version we need or you know.
12:24:15 Do you have this so we'll always check that for you but if we can, if you've sent us something we could upload, we'll upload it right away.
12:24:23 I'll also mention that we handle those embargo periods.
12:24:28 So if you have say, I mentioned a 12 month delay, you don't have to hold onto your manuscript for 12 months, and then try to remember in a year to send it to us send it to us immediately and
12:24:37 we have a way in our system to lock it, so that it only releases after 12 months.
12:24:42 So we handle that for you as well we've other services for each scholarship.
12:24:50 We do what I call an open access review. so say you've been publishing for a long time.
12:24:53 You have a list of publications, and you might wonder like can I make any of these open we'll go through, and we'll see which can be made open, and which versions are allowed to be made open typically it's accepted manuscript But
12:25:05 sometimes publishers surprise us. We can also do a journal policy analysis.
12:25:10 So say you tend to always publish in the same 10 or 15 journals, and you're curious what their policies are. and how do they align?
12:25:18 Maybe with Frq. or try agency. We can do that i've done that for a number of researchers. It can be really handy to have almost a table of like, you know, these 15 journals, and then kind of seeing their policy side
12:25:29 by side, that's something else We can do as I mentioned we take care of copyright permissions, and handling embargoes and delay.
12:25:38 So you're of course welcome to contact me i've also put my colleague jennifer's she's the one that manages the day to day. If you scholarship either or if you have
12:25:46 questions. I also like to tell people that if you're finding what I'm talking about today interesting and you think Oh, this would be great to have in my research group or in front of a departmental meeting or in a student association I
12:25:58 run. I can give this presentation in any format anywhere, so don't hesitate to contact me if this is something you'd like to see in in other settings on campus
12:26:13 So yeah, we talk we'll briefly look well we alluded a little bit to this. So people wonder research gain Academy edu, or open repositories.
12:26:22 And the answer is, no for 2 reasons. One is their closed systems.
12:26:27 So you do have to usually have a login to get out the content.
12:26:31 So you have to give up personal details. so they're not open for that reason. They also don't have preservation mechanisms.
12:26:37 So you know, mcgill's been around since 1,921, and the library hopefully will continue to be there, for you know more time.
12:26:44 But Research Gate could decide tomorrow to shut down and so you know you're open, you know your coffee would be lost.
12:26:50 And I said someone. alluded to earlier. many agreements don't even permit posting to it that's not just.
12:26:57 They don't use these sites it's just they're not good at this.
12:26:59 They're not you know they're not built to be open access repositories.
12:27:02 They're good for market, you know social media connecting and that kind of stuff.
12:27:09 Similarly, if you do have a personal website posting to your website would not meet open access requirements for similar reasons.
12:27:15 Primarily. it's preservation you know if you don't pay your web hosting fee website goes down.
12:27:21 You know that open copy is now gone once again? that's not to say, don't you know you can post versions to your website?
12:27:27 But that's not a mechanism for meeting open access require
12:27:36 Now, sometimes people wonder about subject or pre rep repository.
12:27:39 So in your discipline you might have heard of different other repositories.
12:27:45 Archive is one that's popular with physics there's met archive now with with medical and bio archive with the bio sciences, and there's more of these sort of repositories are
12:27:54 pre-print servers being launched. These can be really great for connecting with your discipline so posting.
12:27:59 You know your pre into there, and and seeing what else is out there.
12:28:03 They can be good for quick dissemination of research.
12:28:06 So pre print server is kind of what it sounds like.
12:28:09 If that first initial submission to your journal posting it to a pre-print server means it kind of gets up there right away, because sometimes it can take a year or longer for your article to go through peer review
12:28:23 and posting your preprint server is typically permitted by most publishers.
12:28:28 But you always want to check the publishers policy before you submit.
12:28:34 I see someone asking about Research square i'm aware of research Research Square.
12:28:38 Unfortunately this i'd have to double check its policies I mean that's how to stay on post.
12:28:43 There i'd have to i'd have to dig into it a little bit further, so I will make a note.
12:28:49 So look at Research Square. Thanks for that. In terms of preprint servers.
12:28:58 They are good for quick dissemination of research and connecting it does vary if they're gonna meet open access policies, because some do require a login, and some only allow the preprint because they're meant to be pre print
12:29:12 servers by their name so they don't sometimes they don't allow you to update with the accepted manuscript.
12:29:17 I've done kind of a quick table here these are this isn't it not an exhaustive list of pre-print servers.
12:29:24 It's just an example. But you can see here that archive for example, allows you to update and upload your accepted manuscript.
12:29:32 So if you wanted to use Archive as your open repository for your accepted manuscript, that would be, try Agency and Frq.
12:29:39 Criteria i've put a couple of other here but Then there are some like you know, bio archive, which is really pitched itself for preprints. only that's kind of That's It's crazy
12:29:49 on that like that's what it's to do so it wouldn't serve that purpose, and then there's other ones like Ssr.
12:29:56 R, which are open kind of, but sometimes also require a login.
12:30:00 So once again they're good for connecting with colleagues, but they may, you know they're not necessarily good for meeting open access requirements of grant agencies
12:30:15 A question you might have at this point is well. how do I know the policies before I submit?
12:30:19 It sounds like they vary there's a really good tool called sure for Romeo.
12:30:24 I'll go to it right now. romeo okay, trying to make my screen a bit bigger.
12:30:31 Okay, so we can do when you go to Sheriff Romeo is, you can type in your journal, So i'm a librarian.
12:30:40 When I look at the Journal of Academic, my brand chip, hey?
12:30:45 This one. Okay, search right So now, i'm on the journals page.
12:30:51 So it's telling me you know who publishes the journal This is an else of your journal.
12:30:55 Then once again, this is important because it's gonna tell you what you can do with the different versions of your paper.
12:31:02 So there's different pathways. but if you want to make the published version of this at this journal.
12:31:08 Open. You have to pay a fee so maybe think I don't wanna do that.
12:31:14 I think. What can I do with my accepted manuscript version?
12:31:17 So for your accepted manuscript. you could post it to your if you had a website, you could post it to your website immediately.
12:31:22 So there's no embargo you have to put on it. What's called a creative commons a certain creative commons license, And they want you to link back to the publisher version with the doi.
12:31:35 Okay, But what if I need to make granting agency criteria?
12:31:37 Jessica, you said, posting to my website, Does any Grant agency criteria?
12:31:41 So go down here. So in this case, if I wanted to post a scholarship, I see that there is a 12 month embargo for non-commercial repositories.
12:31:50 But that would meet try agency and Frq. requirements and sort of similarly, you know, have to link the doi etc.
12:31:58 And if you're curious what they call submitted version the if that's the pre print.
12:32:02 You know, no embargo can post on any website except the nice thing about Sheriff Romeo, too, is that they provide a lot of really good links at the bottom.
12:32:12 So if you wanted to learn more about their sharing policy or maybe you're co-authoring with someone from the Uk, and they might have a different list of embargoes for Uk authors.
12:32:22 What's nice Is they provide these resources at the very bottom of the page?
12:32:26 So this can be a really good resource. if you want to check published like a bunch of journals kind of at once.
12:32:34 And I said i'm an on campus resource for all of these things.
12:32:38 So if you're ever confused or you're looking around, and you can't seem to find it you can always contact me, and I'm happy to check their policies
12:32:50 Before I go into other Faqs. Are there other any questions about, you know finding publisher policies?
12:32:57 Publisher policies in general, things like that
12:33:11 So you might have some questions. I focused today on open access publications, not so much on data.
12:33:19 This is changing this landscape also changing. Some journals now have down policies, so we do have data services to help researchers in this area.
12:33:27 So i've put a link to our research data services website So if you're interested or you started to wonder about open data, you can.
12:33:36 You can go there and contact my colleague lisa I've also posted a link to our research data management guide
12:33:49 And that is, I think, kind of everything I wanted to go over today.